I've spent the past 6 years fretting so much about the climate crisis, I've been neglecting some things. Important things. I've never called myself a feminist, but then I've never called myself much of anything to be honest. I dislike labels, not in the least on myself. But largely, i think what this post is going to be about is that I've been duped. We all have. I was born in 1978, and thought, for all intents and purpose, there was sexual equality. Being a kid in the 80s with a working mother was just a small part of it, seeing others my age with working mothers was another, fathers did stuff with their kids, jobs in all fields were at the very least peppered with both sexes (not entirely true, but I'll get there in a minute). At least, outwardly, women were free to do and be what they wished, and female children had every opportunity to follow that lead. An improvement, to say the least.
The reason I'm addressing this issue now, today, is that there have been a series of events lately, international and otherwise, and also some personal "aha" moments that have dealt me some blows. My husband and I have been together for over 7 years now, and while I haven't been directly comparing this marriage to my last, a great many differences have become apparent. It took a few years into this marriage to realize that my ex, with whom I lived for about 5 years was in some ways deeply misogynist. He talked openly about his disdain for his mother. If the topic was some successful woman, he'd mention how she'd probably fucked her way to the top, and how women would readily do anything to get there. He liked to point out things I didn't know, in a patronizing manner. Told me how to do certain things, even the correct method to stir sauce. There's more, but you get the picture. He was 11 years older that me, and I was 18 when we met, I didn't have the maturity to question it all. I try not to have regrets in my life, and that goes for this too. I did learn an awful lot from it.
As a movement, feminism has been around for a relatively short time. Even the 100 years or so since the suffragette movement are peanuts in a historical perspective, and even though that gained women the right to vote at various dates around the start of the 20th century, feminism as we know it got rolling in the late 60s and 70s. It's this particular wave of feminism I credit for, if not creating gender equality on the job market, at the very least getting women on the job market at all (the female welders of WW2 not withstanding). It's this wave that at the very least challenged the way of thinking about women and their bodies. From commodities to autonomous entities. In theory mind you, as a general practice, we're still not there. And it's not like that it isn't any big surprise either, I think we've been aware of the fact that equality in societies is an ongoing process, continually kept in check by the critical voices, the media, the lawmakers.
In Denmark, they're still trying. Men are now allowed to take, or share the one year maternity/paternity leave, but it's still mostly women taking it. Legislature requiring men to take a portion of it is being considered, which is getting mixed reviews, the negative mostly coming from men. For, instead of seeing it as an opportunity, it's seen as yet another governmental dictate on how someone leads their life (obviously, but that's not always negative. Greater social equality has been gained by requiring people to have an education up to grade 9, also a governmental dictate, but the outcome outweighs the intervention). Another law being considered is a requirement of at least 40% female board members, something that is already in effect in Norway. The law in Norway was ridiculed in the beginning much as Danes (mostly male) are ridiculing it now. While I've yet to see empirical studies on the effects, some naysayers have warmed to it at any rate [Danish link], citing better company profiles because of it. In general, the female critics of this law cite that they don't want more intervention, the male voices cite that there aren't enough qualified women out there to fill 40% of the board seats, subsequently bringing the quality down, and not wanting to partake in an experiment of that kind (part of me wants to point out that this whole existence we're partaking in is an experiment, and as of 2012, while some things are good, I'd say there's room for improvement). What's been missing is an actual discussion of what qualities are needed on the different boards, since my impression has been from a few specific people, that they require a board member of f.ex. a software company to be proficient in coding or datology in general, where as I'd argue that a lawyer, or someone with an MBA would do just fine, and there are many females of the kind to be had out there (as far as IT, women are gaining ground, but IT is still a man-strong field). Board members don't necessarily need to be educated in the profession they're a board member in, as I see it, other criteria might even be extremely helpful. At any rate, it seems that what most people are focusing on in this debate is not the fact that gender equality requires legislation if it's going to happen at a rate faster than 20% per generation (that's my totally made up figure btw), and looking at the crises we're heading for (not to mention the society that steered us there), we can't afford to wait that long. By now I think you know that I believe the 40% quota to be a good idea, in more than one area, but I'll get back to that.
That's just one debate that's gotten me away from my work with the climate crisis, and gotten me on to some different trains of feminist thought, not to mention literature. Another recent even is the whole Ashley Judd has a puffy face debacle. It's so clear to me now that it's not just men who are the misogynists. Women can be misogynists too, at the very least I think most women have probably played the role of misogynist enablers at least once in their lifetimes. I find it hard to harbor ill will against the implied, misogyny is a paradigm people are born into, and frustrating as it can be, people feel safe by adhering to what they're used to. To get back to Ashley Judd, she nailed it. Women (in her line of work) find themselves in a double bind. If they look too good, they've had work done (and deserve ridicule), if they look terrible, they've had work done (and deserve ridicule). And most of this talk is propagated by women. Women who are not famous have felt this in other ways. We joke about how our husbands don't notice when we get our hair cut. But women seem to notice every little change - "have you lost a little weight?", "have you put on a bit of weight?" , "did you get a hair cut?", or "are you using a new eyeliner?" - we notice it all! And mostly, it's with a critical eye. The fact that our husbands haven't noticed those 2 inches have been lopped off is positively refreshing! Now, I'm not going into any "women are our own worst enemies", that's just too destructive a statement, however, I will say that we were born into a culture where women are scrutinized in just about any way you can think of, and for some reason we've just gotten so adept at it, that we think we're complimenting each other, when we're in fact criticizing. Obviously, that's not always the case, we do have a capacity for selflessly telling others how great they look, but just think what implicitly lie in the fact that while we will tell someone they look like they've lost weight, but we won't tell them the opposite. Too bad "you look healthy" never stuck. I try to stick to "you look happy!", if the situation allows. Luckily, it often does. I don't like the rhetorics of "sisterhood" (or brotherhood for that matter, they're a bit on the propaganda-y side for my taste), and if the purpose of using a word like that is supposed to bind women together in a united front for a cause, I'm outta here. It's all hands on deck. Not just women, not just men, it's everyone on all fronts. Culture cuts across gender lines, it's all or nothing.
It starts early, and I'm not talking about giving girls dolls, giving boys trucks. I remember back in junior high, how it started being popular to degrade girls with their vaginas. A popular comment was to tell someone to close their legs when you wanted to put them down - "hey, what's that smell? oh, it's so and so, close your legs!". As if it isn't awkward enough to deal with budding puberty on your own, you've suddenly got to deal with others directly putting down something that in the long run is going to be your friend in a lot of situations. There were lots of other choice ways of putting others (girls) down by way of their reproductive organs, and it was humiliating, debilitating for some, and downright sad. God knows what triggered all the kinds of complexes we're still reeling with 20-30 years down the line. Oh, the plethora of putdowns that cater specifically to women.
Just yesterday, a lot of Danish people on Twitter followed Christiane Vejlø's livetweets during a Dell conference in Copenhagen. They had invited a Danish ...what to call him...self-professed style expert, debater, agony aunt, and provocateur to entertain the attendees. It must be said, the man is not a comic by trade. But nevertheless he made a show out of cajoling laughs out of the (admittedly, mostly) male audience by demanding that women be kept out of IT, boardrooms, politics etc. etc.. Provocation? Hell yes. And had the man been a stand-up comic, he might just've gotten away with it, but he's not, and unfortunately, he did anyway. The pièce de resistance was when he got all the audience members (again, the males) to practice what they were going to say when they got home to their wives- "shut up, bitch". For some reason, this is still a viable form of entertainment. But if at any time during his "show" he'd used the words homosexuals, blacks, muslims where he used the word "women", you can bet there'd be hell to pay. But women are still fair game. Tough job, but someone's gotta do it?
The aftermath wasn't pretty. This is where the typical rhetoric started flying. Men, and a few women, talked about "over-reacting", about women as a pack of hysterical hyenas were making a bunch of fuss over something that was nothing (that whole animal metaphor is a tricky one, if men are aggressive, they're gorillas, and aggression is socially unacceptable enough that the comparison is imo kosher, but women pointing something out and debating in a tempered tone warrants the wild flock of animals comparison - sexist much?) . This is how culturally imbedded misogyny is. The comments I saw with the tag #DellDK were far from hysterical, and there were even a fair number of men making noise about it, so a flock of females it was not, and the "hysteria" was but a cultural habit that we've yet to shake. I recognize how convenient it must be though to have rhetorical ammunition handy when you feel the need to keep some sub-group of society down. But it's old now. Problem is, once you get this far, you can't go back, and you'll see it everywhere. Just today, an article [Danish link] about the new market in Copenhagen appeared in the paper, where one of the vendors at the market accuses the (male) architect behind it of acting like a "pregnant bitch". Oh yes he did.
It's Pandora's box. All of a sudden, the misogyny is all around you. Or, at least, you see it. And not to say that women are the only victims! Men are put into their very own gender-stereotyped box too, and have their own complexes to deal with on another scale. Let's just agree on that keeping people in boxes that they don't necessarily want to be in is so last year.
So. This has been filling my thoughts lately, partially fuelled by the climate crisis, partially fuelled by the mental break I've taken from the climate crisis. Had I been equally concerned about the climate crisis 15 years ago, I would've demanded that women take over the world. From a mother's perspective, many many waking thoughts have gone to my children's future, and sparked a fear, a grief, and then a manic scramble to do anything I can to ensure it. Pretty sure most people physically caring for their kids on a daily basis go through this to some degree. Arguably, women have been the primary care providers. Not to say men haven't thought about their kids futures, but thinking of my own dad, the future was saved by his chipping into my savings account. Even though he retired early and was around the house every day, I wouldn't say he parented me. My mom did that, despite working two jobs and continually going to school. Equality's changing that. Men are there to physically care for, manhandle (I mean this in a good way), love their children, think about their futures while they're wiping bottoms. It's part of the whole experience. I'm not as militant about it as I might've been 10 years ago, nowadays I'm more militant about just getting our fingers out regarding the climate crisis. Like I said before, all hands on deck. And feminism is definitely a part of the climate crisis. As is inequality in so many forms. Every social imbalance is a symptom of a bad deal for us all in the long run.
I wish I could say I've got it all figured out, far from it. I find myself at a loss for words more often than not in these kinds of discussions. So much of my frustration is based on a lot of feelings of inequality that've become apparent from time to other, without really knowing how it worked. That's because of the cultural nature of it. I picked up this poignant quote on Twitter the other day (@adamserwer): "Sexism and racism are not about mean things people say. They're about the spoken and unspoken rules that govern lives and opportunities". And those rules can be awfully hard to change!
We were at friends' for dinner last week, ended up having a bottle of wine too much perhaps, anyway, juices started flowing. All of a sudden, our friend asks - "what's with this feminist trip you're on?". Again, I prefer not to be labelled anything, but you know, in this case, I guess I'm going to have to suck it up. So we start talking. Beauty pageants, bla bla bla, talking about the differences that appear in parenting the minute someone says "it's a girl!" (he has a daughter, always dressed in pink/purple, dresses, princess outfits etc. etc.). He doesn't get it. Thinks quotas are ridiculous, and women have all the opportunity men do, and that's indeed how he was raised to think. Theory and practice, you know. We run through the facts - women in Denmark earn 18% less than men on average [Danish link], this despite all the progress we've made otherwise. He mentioned the physical differences - "women are soft". Right. You can only go so far with a "it's natural" argument. Social differences based on biological differences alone are one thing, backing them up based on rational arguments that include biology are another, ie. women should stay home for x amount of time after giving birth, etc. But women being "soft" is in my view a question of aesthetics, and in this case cultural aesthetics. Men can be soft too. They're just not "supposed" to be. That's the difference. And it's bollocks. Where my friend did get the last word was when he said - "I'm tired of hearing this crap! Feminism hasn't brought anything new to the table since it began!". And while that's not entirely true (which he's quickly discover if he bothered googling for an hour or so), he's partially right. And while I wouldn't call it an Achilles Heel exactly, I've definitely put my finger on one big thing the feminist movement should focus on more.
I wouldn't say we've been focusing on the wrong thing, I guess each aspect of this (and there are many) have each their own time. Being allowed to vote, and thereby becoming an independent voice is society was a natural place to start. Working outside the home was the next. Getting the same jobs as men the next, same pay, etc. By and large, we've overcome a lot of important hurdles. Reproductive rights too, though they teeter uneasily on the brink in the US as of this writing. State authorized misogyny right there. It's almost amusing that men would so blatantly disregard the benefits they themselves get out of reproductively autonomous women, but I digress. So we've focused on bringing women upwards, so to speak, to the same level as men, to enjoy the same benefits. But that's only one sex, one direction. Now, this is one of those things that had to wait I guess, due to cultural norms being so hard to get moving. So female sexuality has previously been seen as a commodity, a gift, a precious thing to be saved, and cherished and kept pristine until it's given away in marriage. And exactly this type of sexual objectifiction has been for the male heterosexual audience. Where has male objectification been? It's been corralled into a Chippendales-subsection of female sexuality that was, if anything, more entertaining and funny haha than it was in a "we're horny and we mean business" way. Note the lack of male heterosexual prostitutes. I've pointed this out many times over the years, and gotten "there's not a market for it" back. Well, duh. If women are earning 18% less than men on average, dontcha think we're spending what we've got on the kids, or food, or fashion and beauty, as has been dictated in this long and proud tradition of female objectification and commoditization? Perhaps if we had that extra 18% in our pocket, and had an upbringing where our parents gave us a pack of condoms and a pat on our backs at 15, we'd have been here long before.
And this is where I get back to the 40% quotas. Admittedly, there are fields I might find it slightly ridiculous to impose them - construction workers, fisherman - at a later time perhaps. But this is now, and I think the places where it would be timely and socially progressive to impose them are as stated, in the boardroom, but also, in prostitution. Instead of the old "lets do away with prostitution" that's really not gotten rid of the problem as of yet, let's try something new. Let's put male (hetero) sexuality on the market next to the female one and see if that doesn't help men in legislature (still the majority in most government) see the whole kit and caboodle in a different and more objectified light.
I think I'm about done for now. I'll probably have to update this post with things I forgot to get in, and clarifications on things my astute readers no doubt will call me on. Be fair though, I'd had enough, and wrote this out in one long 3 hour session without too much research, I'll be amending that as well.
What I want people to take away from this post is - everything is not as it seems. Bullshit, misogyny, and the patriarchal paradigm just have an inertia factor together of 1000% (totally fictive number on a fictive scale). But it's not as bad when you know what you're up against.
15 comments:
Like you I believe men and women should have equal rights, as well as duties. Yes, conditions for women do suck at various levels and in some parts of the world horribly so – but men too are discriminated against: why is it only men (except in Israel whose army encompasses men and women alike) that get conscripted and have to put their lives on hold and on the line to defend their country or sent way to war? Why is it still mostly women that get child custody after a divorce? Why is school traditionally organized to fit girls better than boys? Being the mother of two, you know how boys are more physical, but in school they probably have to sit nicely for hours and hours every day. Why don’t more women apply for high-ranking jobs instead of choosing low-paid jobs like nurses, educators and the like?
I’ve had male as well as female bosses and I can tell you one thing: women are not kinder bosses, quite the opposite in fact: the greatest bastards I’ve had as bosses were all women!
As far as board membership goes I’m totally against quotas: the best qualified people should get the jobs, don't you think?
I consider myself a feminist, and the stupidity of this is just infinite. Last year I was happy to see that some of the women I know from twitter attended the yearly Microsoft event "Community Day", and the organiseres had hired an army of young women in high heels as servants, later when one of the Microsoft representatives did a demo, it was of a "boob app", and this was after having settled a discussion of why no women were inivted as speakers (turned out that you had to submit something to be considered, something no women did).
Regarding the quotas for boardmembership, I refuse to believe that you can't find just ONE qualified woman to sit on the board of say Carlsberg. I'm probably against fixed quotas, but "something" doesn't add up with these all male boards, and yes I've overheard top-management discuss having women serve on their board, that was not pleasant to listen to...
This always confuses me:
"Why is school traditionally organized to fit girls better than boys?"
School (in Denmark, at least) is made by men. Back in the days of HC Anderson, only boys were allowed to go to school. If you couldn't sit still, one of the older boys, the male teacher, would slap you. It hasn't changed much since, other than girls being allowed, and no slapping.
And because the teacher profession suddenly lost prestige, men stopped wanting to be teachers.
So now there's a lot of female teachers and suddenly school is made to fit girls better than boys? It hasn't changed. Children still show up in the morning, are sat on their chairs and taught, and are asked to concentrate and be quiet. -ish.
Personally, I loved the competitiveness of the male environment of school. Marching in line, getting grades to see who were best, the seriousness of being a scholar.
Are these qualities traditionally associated with girls? I was a girl. A lot of the other girls didn't thrive. Some of the boys did, some of the boys didn't.
So maybe it's not so much a gender thing, who's fit for school. Maybe it's just an individual thing. This is my belief.
@rankenberg: my point is that in Denmark I've often heard of boys "not being ready to start school" at the age of 6 and having to wait another year while girls usually are more mature at that age. Mature for what? For sitting down nicely, taking in verbal information - something females are naturally better at. If school somehow became more physical and information was presented using several modalities, probably all boys would be mature enough at 6 and keep motivated enough to study on - whereas today, in Denmark at least, there's still a greater percentage of females carrying on with higher educations.
What made me weary of the whole Dell debacle was that it had the usual Danish overtone to it. Nothing new, nothing overtly astounding, just the usual bad manners and lack of brains and empathy so common in DK so little variation on a theme. We say what we like, we do what we like, we are Danish. It was the arrogance of the thing, the way it was brushed aside and people accused of taking it too seriously.
The ensuing fight over it, people clamoring to try and state what is right and wrong is fruitless. IMO. What needs to change is the way people are educated in Denmark, because what is lacking in this country is empathy and intelligence. Both qualities are not encouraged in the institutions in Denmark. Kids are automatically put in institutions away from the influence of their families from an extremely early age,normally a non verbal age and the process begins. They don't learn manners, they learn how to be Danish. There is very little difference between the daycare on offer in Denmark be it private or public because they are all still operating within very narrow margins. All kids in Denmark are brought up to be part of a very narrow minded mindset, and this is a lot to do with the tightness of the Danish world, give or take the odd 'alternative' streak. The Dell debacle could have been about any issue. It's an accurate revelation about the bottom line in Denmark. All talk about democracy is a front.
Great post, BTW, xxx
@vida - agreeing on most counts, including that yes, the best qualifications should count. In practice however, this is not happening. Here are two links with empirical evidence that that is not the case:
http://bizzen.blogs.business.dk/2012/03/15/dumpet-til-bestyrelser-er-altid-udpeget-de-mest-kompetente/
http://bizzen.blogs.business.dk/2012/03/17/bestyrelser-med-medfodt-storhedsvanvid/
Since, that argument is based on false pretenses, I can't see any good argument against quotas.
@ranky - thanks for piping up in this debate!
@Kim Bach - that goes for you too! <3
@Babs - welcome back love! Thx so much, and I agree wholeheartedly - it IS arrogance on a scale only a small country with as many complexes as Denmark could produce!
I enjoy reading your post and feeling that you're passionate about it. And you're totally right that even in social events when I bring up the 40% quote I get attacked by other women and men. We need the changes to start at the top, so mentalities start to change too.
Women get more attacked by other women and men, especially in the US, the catty culture is so promoted, the "mean girl" is the popular one and those reality shows love showing mean girls.
Dear Sir or Madam,
Some weeks ago - on 30.03.2012 - I left comment on your blog and I would very much appreciate a quick status update.
I’m looking forward to your response.
Kind regards,
Malte Zeeck
Malte - no thanks.
You say that but in the meantime you were the one at home with your sons while your husband was basically the breadwinner. If you were so much into 'feminism' you would have tried your hardest to get a decent job first thing and have asked your husband to take over the cooking, parenting etc... I don't want to come across as mean or anything and I do agree with your points of view but it just reminds me a bit of 'do what I say not what I do'.
Anonymous - Thought i'd replied, apparently not, sorry (if you ever get around to checking!
A year of parental leave per child is the norm here, my husband and I shared the second child's (the first child was born while my husband was working at a non-kid friendly place).
I have been either studying or working (self-employed), outside of the parental leave so I'm not sure what you're getting at? I also came into the marriage with quite a bit of capital that has paid for more than my husband has been able to, so come again :)
ps - it's also ok to have opinions about things, even though you're not directly affected. Politicians do it all the time :)
Nice post, Jennie.
I'm skipping directly to the last part - "where are all the male prostitutes"?
Maybe they are not there because women are not raised and trained to see men as objects, as property; and so are mostly not comfortable treating them as such. It doesn't feel "natural" because they lack the training.
I think it is true that the market is not there, because demand for female prostitutes rests on a sense of entitlement that girls just aren't raised into.
Thøger - Thanks so much for reading and commenting! I agree completely, what you said there is basically my point, I just didn't get to the punch as well as you :)
So it is with many things. The conditioning. We've been conditioned one way or another, or vice versa. At the time of writing, I'd only just had my epiphany a few years earlier, done a lot of thinking, not a lot of talking. Now I've got a lot of reading to do as well (after the fucking thesis).
I'm just so dismayed that people by and large are so 'gumpetung', to use a Danish word. Have such difficulty turning their world upside down, if only mentally, and fleetingly, trying to imagine how the world didn't have to be.
Another thing I thought of, and this is more pertaining to Susanna's comment of Vida's comment - about Danish schools (and in other countries for that matter) and their feminization: the same dude I talked about, my ex, he often complained about the very same. Or all Danish institutions for that matter, how very female they were, not allowing boys to be boys etc. He was angry at women about that, among other things, misogynist that he was. I've thought a lot about that since, I seemed to have blindly accepted the notion that indeed, the high number of females in the institutions here were to blame. Indeed they are NOT. Instead, perhaps my ex's energy, and any other critic's energy, might be better put to use directing their misguided anger to the men who thought of this type of vocation as a female job. Where were they?
Sorry, got sidetracked while I was as it.
Yes - I agree. Women aren't "trained", as you put it, to objectify men like that. Now the dilemma is, is it right to start doing so? Do 2 wrongs make a right? I'm inclined to think being a female chauvinist pig for a spell might be the right way to go until more equality is reached, without tipping the equilibrium completely over to the other side. But a swine is a swine, regardless of revenge in inter-gender relations.
After a bit of though, I think I'd like to modify my statement a bit. Women are trained to objectify men, but in a different way. A way I cannot quite get a hold of. Back in the day, it was as husbands,m providers, trophies, and fathers in the theatre of Family. Today, it is a bit more wiggly.
In fact, I think you could really boil down the whole "crisis of the modern man" stuff that Eva Agnete Selsing, Søren Fauli and all the others are so concerned about, into the question: What should men be objectified as, now that last year's model seems to have gone out of fashion?
It's important to remember, though, that just because objectification and stereotyping goes both ways, doesn't mean we're suddenly on equal footing.
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